Sahir Ludhianvi: Silver Memories, Romantic Sahir Options Rating

[mmuk2004]

Its indeed thrilling to see a very informed discussion and analysis of some of the finest Urdu lyrics written in the annals of Hindi Film Industry, by Shair-e-Azam Sahir Ludhianvi. Unfortunately a hectic work schedule doesn't permit me to contribute as frequently as some of you are doing but I am indeed grategul for this enriching experience.

I would like to reiterate what I wrote about a year back in the same thread but under a different title, Sahir - A Great Lyricist

"Given the all pervading crass commercialism in our society leading to younger minds running after professions which would fetch millions in salaries or profits and completely ignoring the study of languages, it is highly unlikely that 21 century will ever see the emergence of young poets in any language, leave alone the geniuses of the caliber of Sahir. So let's be thankful that we lived in an age in which Sahir bestowed upon us the finest Urdu ghazals and nazms, many of which became even more memorable as they were set to music and sung by legendary music directors and singers of our times."

Pradeep

Pradeep thank you for the wonderfully expressed paragraph about Sahir. Whenever you have the time, please do share your comments on Sahir, it would be much appreciated by all us Sahir fans.

[mmuk2004]

Lata,

I thought you had written out the lyrics for the song from Bahu Begum but I don't see it now. Just give me a couple of days to get back to it.

On Lata's behalf...

Duniya kare sawaal to hum kya jawab de
Tum ko na ho khayal to hum kya jawab de (Duniya...)

Pooche koi ke dil ko kahaan chhod aaye hain
Kis kis se apna rishta e jaan tod aaye hai
Mushkil ho arz e haal...
Mushkil ho arz e haal to hum kya jawab de
Tum ko na ho khayal to hum kya jawab de (Duniya...)


Poochhe koi ke dard e wafa kaun de gaya
Raaton ko jaag ne ki sazaa kaun de gaya
Kah ne se ho malaal...
Kah ne se ho malaal to hum kya jawab de
Tum ko na ho khayal to hum kya jawab de (Duniya...)

[

Thanks Tji .....Madhavi take ur time ...Me waiting patiently

Thanks Tji for the lyrics and Lata for your interest...


Khayaal...it is such a layered word in urdu.
Khayaal: thought
Khayaal rahe: to keep in mind
Khayaal rakhna: to take care
khayaal karo: to consider
I am sure there are many more nuances that I have not touched upon...

"Duniya Kare sawaal to ham kya jawab de/tum ko na ho khayaal to ham kya jawab de" ...The sense of being forsaken and defeated is so poignantly conveyed in these two lines.

"Kis kis se apna rishta e jaan tod aaye hain"...the isolation the woman feels is from both sides, on the one hand she has alienated herself from the rest of the world and on the other hand she has been forsaken by her lover.

Had to check on the word "malaal" which again has more than one tone, it means sadness, grief and also langour,fatigue. Someone who is familiar with Urdu can perhaps give us some more insights but at that moment when I read the meaning of the word it fitted the song so well, not just the sadness the woman feels but also the loneliness and sense of defeat that she expresses when she says "tumko na ho khayaal"... that is what isolates her the most, which finally makes it impossible for her to answer any questions...

A beautiful moody song, it rises above the garish sets of the movie. An ageing,overblown and heavily made up Meena Kumari however still manages to give it the right touch of sadness and fatigue... the sense of being unable to answer all those questions. Never found Meena Kumari conventionally attractive but she had such an interesting face, it had a hint of decadence, a knowlegde of tragedy and incredible empathy all of which was captured by Guru Dutt in the role tailor-made for her, as Chhoti Bahu in Sahib Biwi aur Ghulam.

[Anupama]

Wow! Excellent work, Madhvi. Very impressive and extremely informative! How did I miss this thread? Finally, someone has taken the initiative to indite about my neglected Sahir Ludhianvi. What a great poet, he was! I am fortunate and blessed to have hailed from Punjab. I was born in Ludhiana and went to the same government college where Sahir studied and walked on the same portals as Sahir Ludhianvi did.

I have always been fascinated by Sahir's poetry. He has influenced me to great extents.

Sahir has penned over 700 filmy songs. I already have more than 400 of Sahir's songs and wish to someday acquire all his songs. Who can forget his first recorded song - "Mohabbat Tark Ki Maine" - sung in Talat Mehmood's silken voice, and his first released song "Thandi Hawayein" sung by Lata. Each and every Sahir's song is close to my heart.My favorite soaked in liquor song of Sahir is "Mehfil Se Uth Jaane Waalon". Madhvi, I would appreciate it if you could comment on this song ( take your time , I know I am last in queue). You might be aware that this song was written for Amrita Pritam and Imroz.

Amrita Pritam wrote in her autobiography - Raseedi Ticket :-

"I recall - many years ago when Sahir had come to Delhi, he invited and Imroz to the hotel where he was staying. We were there for a couple of hours. Sahir had placed an order for whisky and there were three glasses on the table. We returned deep into the night.And when it was almost midnight - Sahir called me up saying : " There are still three glasses lying on the table, and by turn I am sipping from each of them, and writing '' These Empty Goblets Are My Companions." ( Mere Saathi Khaali Jaam )

Then she writes - Only nature is likely to know that there was some thread, who knows related to which birth, which even in this birth was wrapped around the three of us.In 1990 when Jalandhar Doordarshan shot a film on my life they asked me to reflect on my relationship with both Sahir Ludhianvi and Imroz - At that point , I had said - "There is only one sole relationship of pain - of agony - of the hiccup of separation - of musical resonance of the pipe which can be heard despite those hiccups of longing.This was the relationship with Sahir - this is the relationship with Imroz.. This was Sahir's love when I wrote : -

Tumhe Phir Yaad Kiya Hai
Hum Ne Phir Aag Ko Chooma
Ishq Chahe Ek Zehar Ka Pyala Sahi
Maine Ek Ghoont Peena Chaha__Amrita Pritam

Not only Sahir's filmy songs but also his other work captivates and fascinates me. The intensity in his poetry deeply moves me and leaves me enthralled. I possess both of his books - Talkhiyaan and Aao Koi Khwab Bune. I am yet to acquire another book of his - Gaata Jaaye Banjara (suggested by a friend of mine). Sahir's poetry does not only focus on love and romance, but also captures other aspects of life. The bleak realities of life are exposed. In his poetry, Sahir reveals pain and suffering, his respect for women, his great understanding and acceptance of various religions, and his desire to find harmony and tranquility in life. His poetry reveal both his positive outlook and his rebellious and cynical spirit towards life. He arrived at a philosophy of his own.

I wish he could have lived for many more years. He left behind many of admirers like us.

Thanks Madhvi. What a treat!

Nafrat Jo Sikhaye Woh Dharam Tera Nahin Hai
Insaan Ko Raunde Woh Qadam Tera Nahin Hai
Quraan Na Ho Jis Mein Woh Mandir Nahin Tera
Geeta Na Ho Jis Mein Woh Haram Tera Nahin Hai
Tu Aman Aur Sulah Ka Armaan Banega
Insaan Ki Aulad Hai, Insaan Bangea - Sahir Ludhianvi

What a superb, impassioned write-up Anupama That is exactly the way I feel when I read Sahir, engaged. He engages me with his varied insights, his empathy, and the amazing simplicity with which he can state the most complicated of observations. Would love to hear your insights into his poetry , which songs that you want to wax eloquent about. I restricted myself mainly to songs that were not often discussed vis-a-vis Sahir, as they were very much part of the mainstream cinema of that time and not particularly radical in their orientation and I wanted people to notice that even ordinary, situational songs were transformed when Sahir penned them down.

Please do give us some more write-ups on songs that you want to write about... or add on your comments to the songs already discussed. Would love to read about them...

Madhavi

Thanks Madhavi, I will surely contribute to this thread in whatever manner I can and with whatever little knowledge I have (whenever time permits.) Please keep up the good work. It's always a pleasure to read your posts.

[Lata]

Thanks Tji for the lyrics and Lata for your interest...


Khayaal...it is such a layered word in urdu.
Khayaal: thought
Khayaal rahe: to keep in mind
Khayaal rakhna: to take care
khayaal karo: to consider
I am sure there are many more nuances that I have not touched upon...

"Duniya Kare sawaal to ham kya jawab de/tum ko na ho khayaal to ham kya jawab de" ...The sense of being forsaken and defeated is so poignantly conveyed in these two lines.

"Kis kis se apna rishta e jaan tod aaye hain"...the isolation the woman feels is from both sides, on the one hand she has alienated herself from the rest of the world and on the other hand she has been forsaken by her lover.

Had to check on the word "malaal" which again has more than one tone, it means sadness, grief and also langour,fatigue. Someone who is familiar with Urdu can perhaps give us some more insights but at that moment when I read the meaning of the word it fitted the song so well, not just the sadness the woman feels but also the loneliness and sense of defeat that she expresses when she says "tumko na ho khayaal"... that is what isolates her the most, which finally makes it impossible for her to answer any questions...

A beautiful moody song, it rises above the garish sets of the movie. An ageing,overblown and heavily made up Meena Kumari however still manages to give it the right touch of sadness and fatigue... the sense of being unable to answer all those questions. Never found Meena Kumari conventionally attractive but she had such an interesting face, it had a hint of decadence, a knowlegde of tragedy and incredible empathy all of which was captured by Guru Dutt in the role tailor-made for her, as Chhoti Bahu in Sahib Biwi aur Ghulam.

Madhavi, Thank you for the write up.

[mmuk2004]

Had this one saved...

Khuda-e-Bartar - Lata - Taj Mahal - Roshan - Sahir

Khuda-e-Bartar Teri Zamiin Par, Zamiin Ki Khaatir Ye Jung Kyun Hai
Har Ek Fateh-o-Zafar Ke Daaman Pe Khoon-e-Insaan Ka Rang Kyun Hai
Khuda-e-Bartar Teri Zamiin Par, Zamiin Ki Khaatir Ye Jung Kyun Hai...

bartar = surpassing ; fatah = conquest by means of jihad ;
zafar = Conquest, Gain, Triumph, Victory

Zamiin Bhi Teri, Hain Hum Bhi Tere, Ye Milkiyat Ka Sawaal Kya Hai
Ye Qatl-o-Khoon Ka Rivaaz Kyun Hai, Ye Rasm-e-Jang-o-Jadaal Kya Hai
Jinhein Talab Hai Jahaan Bhar Ki, Unhiin Ka Dil Itna Tang Kyun Hai
Khuda-e-Bartar Teri Zamiin Par, Zamiin Ki Khaatir Ye Jung Kyun Hai

milkiyat = Keeping/possession/property ; jadaal = list
talab = quest/Pursuit/demand/search ; tang = Limited

Gareeb Maaon Shareef Behnon Ko Amn-o-Izzat Ki Zindagi De
Jinhein Ataa Kii Hai Tu Ne Taaqat, Unhein Hidaayat Ki Roshni De
Saron Mein Kibr-o-Ghuroor Kyun hai, Dilon Ke Sheeshe Pe Zang Kyun Hai
Khuda-e-Bartar Teri Zamiin Par, Zamiin Ki Khaatir Ye Jung Kyun Hai

amn = peace ; ataa = gift ; hidaayat = Guidance/Instruction/Righteousness
kibr = arrogance/grandness

Khazaa Ke Raste Pe Jaanewaalon Ko Bachke Aane Ki Raah Dena
Dilon Ke Gulshan Ujad Na Jaaye, Mohabbaton Ko Panaah Dena
Jahaan Mein Jashn-e-Wafaa Ke Badle, Ye Jashn-e-Teer-o-Tafang Kyun Hai
Khuda-e-Bartar Teri Zamiin Par, Zamiin Ki Khaatir Ye Jung Kyun Hai

kazaa = death; panaah = protection/shelter
jashn = party/celebration ; tafang = musket

Came across a discussion on this song at HF some time ago while googling...The meanings in bold interspersed in the body of the poem are all from posts on that discussion.

An anti war song that transcends time to be tragically relevant even today. It is imbued with Sahir's secular and humanistic consciousness and has resonating lines such as: "Har ek Fateh-o-Zafar ke daman pe khoone-e-insaan ka rang kyun hai". Why is it that (the lap of) every religious war/victory is stained with humar blood?

The use of the word "daaman"(lap/suggesting shelter/protection) highlights a sense of betrayal (the "lap" of religious wars not providing succor and protection but brutal murders), that tends to get lost in the translation.

"Zamin bhi teri,hain hum bhi tere/Ye milkiyat ka sawal kyun hai" This is not the iconclastic Sahir of "Aasman pe hai khuda aur zamin pe hum/Aaj kal wo is taraf dekhta hai kam". Here he positions himself within the religious consciousness and argues that if as believers we believe that the world is yours and we are yours then how does the issue of possession/ownership and wresting of property come in?

"Jinhen talab hai jahan bhar ki/Unhi ka dil itna tang kyun hai" (Those who are worried about the whole world...this is radical Sahir again bitterly hitting out against religious leaders, actually all demagogues...)

From the larger issues, Sahir comes down to individual traits that fan these larger issues..."Saron me kibr-o-ghuroor kyun hai" "Dilon ke sheeshe pe zang kyun hai" These are situations and charateristics that one faces in everyday, ordinary life that escalate into bloodshed and violence... "Jahan mein jashn-e-wafa ke badle ye jashn-e-teer-o-tafang kyun hai"...

It is a dark poem exposing the futility of war and the human expense at which such wars are fought and is posited as a series of protests to the Almighty in the form of rhetorical questions. However, interspersed in the protests are also some requests by the poet to the almighty...

Gareeb Maaon Shareef Behnon Ko Amn-o-Izzat Ki Zindagi De
Jinhein Ataa Kii Hai Tu Ne Taaqat, Unhein Hidaayat Ki Roshni De

Khazaa Ke Raste Pe Jaanewaalon Ko Bachke Aane Ki Raah Dena
Dilon Ke Gulshan Ujad Na Jaaye, Mohabbaton Ko Panaah Dena

The poet has not given up all hope, he requests for peace, he asks that those who have power use is correctly, he wants those who face death to be able to come back safely... "Mohabbaton ko panaah dena"...beautiful lines, even though he reverts back to the darker questioning by the end of the poem. The poem precariously hangs between despair and hope...

[visuja]

Thanks once again

Do save your analysis on the various songs...... They're quite insightful...
....and once never knows ...

[mmuk2004]

Thanks Vivek, and please call me Madhavi. Ji gives me some "ji"tters

Setting the scene for romance... Weather and the ambience permitting, the lovers gear up to admit to the great emotion...

Jaal:1952:SDB
Ye raat ye chandni phir kahan
Sun ja dil ki dastaan..

Joru Ka Bhai:1955:Jaidev
Surmai raat hai sitare hain...aaj dono jahan hamare hain
Subah ka intezaar kaun kare
Phir ye rut ye sama mile na mile
Aarzoo ka chaman khile na khile
Waqt ka aetbaar kaun kare..

House No.44 : 1955:SDB
Chup hai dharti chup hain chand sitare
Mere dil ki dhadkan tujhko pukare


Vaasna:1968:Chitragupt
Ye parbaton ke daere ye shaam ka dhuaan
Aise mein kyun na ched de dilon ki dastaan...

Girlfriend:1960:HK
Kashti ka khamosh safar hai shaam bhi hai tanhai bhi
Door kinare par bajti hain lehron ki shehnai bhi
Aaj mujhe kuch kehna hai

Love this Kishore gem from the sixties. Interesting song, the lover sets the scene for the song, and the girl is impatient to hear him confess to his love, and yet by the end of the song, he has not said the "kuch" that he sets out to say at the beginning. A teaser of a confession, he manages to get the girl to admit to the emotion, gets a commitment for the relationship and then... "Chodo ab kya kehna hai" ... Smart man... Sahir playing with words again, setting the scene and then undermining it, suggesting that commitment does not really need verbal expression...

Do add on more "ambience" songs to this list...

Am uploading two of the above songs from Girlfriend and Joru ka Bhai.

[unni]

Madhavi:

Members like you and Nasir-bhai bring a new dimension to this forum.

Sincerely appreciated. Heartfelt thanks!

[nasir]

HAM AAPKI MEHFIL ME.N
BHOOLE SE CHALE AAYE,
HO MUAAF KHATA APNI
.....KE AB TAK NAHI.N AAYE.

Brilliant, topic this.
Madhviji....I never realised we had such analysis going on here.
This will surely become my favourite haunt for I hope to learn a lot here.

NASIR.

[mmuk2004]

Unni and Nasir Ji

Thank you for your warm appreciation.

By the way Nasir Ji, as I keep saying no Madhavi ji, only Madhavi. I checked on the two great threads that you have started on Mohd. Rafi Sahab, after reading Unni's comment. My loss that it was the first time I had visited those threads. Anyway, der aaye par durust aaye. Will keep tabs on both of 'em now. I enjoyed all the incidental details that you had included about the movies along with the translations. And how wonderful to have actually met Sahir. We definitely look forward to having some insights from you.

Just realised that a longish post by Anupama is lost, I hope she has saved it...

BC, if you have that long comment about Sahir's verse that you had posted in response to the Bahu Begum song, please post it again. I was planning to translate it as you had requested.

[ashgupta3]

Madhavi ji I have been watching this thread for a while now, and didnt mean to give u jitters but that "ji" is added as a mark of respect for starting this thread and for ur admiration & wonderful description of Sahir's songs

Do add on more "ambience" songs to this list...

Here r some more

Naujawaan, SDB
Thandi hawayen lehra ke gaayen
rut hai jawaan unko yahan kaise bulaayen

House #44, SDB
Faili huyi hain sapno ki baahen
aaja chal dein kahin door
wahi meri manzil wahi teri raahen
aaja chal dein kahin door

Mujhe Jeene Do, Jaidev
Raat bhi hai kuch bheegi bheegi
chaand bhi hai kuch maddham maddham
tum aao to aankhen khole
soyi huyi payal ki cham cham

Aaj aur kal, Ravi
Yeh waadiyaan yeh fizaayen bula rahin hain tumhe
khamoshiyon ki sadayen bula rahin hain tumhe

Shagun, Khayyam
Parbaton ke pedon par shaam ka basera hai
surmayi ujala hai champai andhera hai

Kaajal, Ravi
Aaj ki raat nahi sikve shikayat ke liye
aaj ki raat muraadon ki baraat aayi

Aadmi Aur Insaan, Ravi
O neele parbaton ki dhara aayi dhoondne kinara, badi door se
sabko sahara chaahiye
koi hamara chaahiye

ps: it seems like eternity since this thread is stuck on page 6

[bawlachintu]

Unni and Nasir Ji

Thank you for your warm appreciation.

By the way Nasir Ji, as I keep saying no Madhavi ji, only Madhavi. I checked on the two great threads that you have started on Mohd. Rafi Sahab, after reading Unni's comment. My loss that it was the first time I had visited those threads. Anyway, der aaye par durust aaye. Will keep tabs on both of 'em now. I enjoyed all the incidental details that you had included about the movies along with the translations. And how wonderful to have actually met Sahir. We definitely look forward to having some insights from you.

Just realised that a longish post by Anupama is lost, I hope she had saved it...

BC, if you have that long comment about Sahir's verse that you had posted in response to the Bahu Begum song, please post it again. I was planning to translate it as you had requested.

I will definitely try to recollect the thought. Wakai ek khoobsoorat khayal tha jo hawa ke jhonke ki tarah dimag mein aaya. Usi din maine "Kagaz te canvas" padi thi. Except writing
for blogs I never made backup of anything. Sad!

[cinemaniac2]

super thread Madhavi

excellent job-

HF-has wonders in all corners-kudos to Pradeep

Sahir sahab is one of my favourite

I am glad u have not yet covered one of my all time favourites from him

yun to kuch kam nahin jo aap ne ehsan kiye
par jo mange se na paya woh sila yaad aaya

wish MR had sung them-but MK has not done a bad job

woh afsana jise anjaam tak lana na ho mumkin
use ik khubsurat mod deke bhool na behtar

the songs had a tremendous effect if u see the movie-it had relevance

ilm nahin tha itni jaldi khatma fasane ho jayenge
tum begane ban jaoge hum diwane ho jayenge

pls put ur input on this movie-one of my all time sahir's best

raah mein bichi hui hai meri har nazar
main tadap raha hoon aur tu hai bekhabar

once again Madhavi-kudos to u-good job-great thread

[nasir]

Unni and Nasir Ji

Thank you for your warm appreciation.

By the way Nasir Ji, as I keep saying no Madhavi ji, only Madhavi. I checked on the two great threads that you have started on Mohd. Rafi Sahab, after reading Unni's comment. My loss that it was the first time I had visited those threads. Anyway, der aaye par durust aaye. Will keep tabs on both of 'em now. I enjoyed all the incidental details that you had included about the movies along with the translations. And how wonderful to have actually met Sahir. We definitely look forward to having some insights from you.

Just realised that a longish post by Anupama is lost, I hope she has saved it...

BC, if you have that long comment about Sahir's verse that you had posted in response to the Bahu Begum song, please post it again. I was planning to translate it as you had requested.

Okay, no "Ji", Madhavi. Thanks for the encouragement re those two threads. But Madhavi, I am no Urdu buff, nor have any knowledge of urdu unfortunately, save and excepting that it happens to be my mother-tongue. The truth is, I learnt some Urdu or Hindustani from our filmy songs. So I would not be able to come up with any worthwhile contribution in this forum despite my desires. No point in showing the lamp to the sun. But I am going to educate myself here. Please accept my heartiest congratulations for highlighting Sahir Sahaab's poems (and some of them are "toughie" like the one you translated above) and bringing them to common people like us. All the best Madhavi.

NASIR.

p.s. No "ji" please. All the best...again..

[ashgupta3]

Just realised that a longish post by Anupama is lost, I hope she has saved it...

I too am looking forward for that mail, I vaguely remember it. So if she or someone else has saved it, plz post it. Anyway I think we need to hear more often from someone who has walked on the same portals as Sahir.